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out of curiosity, what level do they swim at?  I don't keep these fish, but if they are at lower levels, is it possible your lower water is not oxygenated enough?  I only thought of this because erin mentioned the oxygenation of the water.

Hi BB.  For me the German Blue Rams would just die.  Than I had luck with the Bolivian Rams.

So I decided to try one last time with some German Blue Rams and Gold Rams, also.  The German Blue ones died for me again.  But, this time I looked at temperatures and started - yes, started - to read on the Internet what all they liked and did not.  Should have done that first but believe some of us do things backwards - grin.

The German Blues were in a tank with the temperatures of only 76.  The Gold Rams were in two tanks with temperatures of 78/79.  I know just one degree or two more and the Gold ones made it and were doing great.  The Gold Rams are now in a 29 gal with two pleco BN, some pygmy type cory cat, some Oto;s and some Bumblebee Gobies.  Plants, sinking driftwood, rocks, flower pots and believe that about covers it.  Oh, the temps in that tank are 81/82.

So I got some Electric Blues and that grow up tank was approx. 79/80 and they made it.  They are now in a 20 gal. long - temps are 81/82 with the only other critters - three LFBN.  Plants, flower pts and sinking wood - think that covers the majority of what is in that tank.  They are doing great with all their bickering and demanding to be fed.

So for me it was the temperatures.  On what to have in their tanks like company or that.  I do not know.  Others could tell you better than I could on what to put with them.  I have gotten to where I only have so many types in a tank and I call that a Community tank now- grin.

Edited to add -  I almost forgot, the Electric Blue Rams - the males swim on the bottom and chase the females where they  swim near the top.  The Gold Rams in the 29 gal swim all over that tank keeping the other male on his side.  Forgot to mention they are two pairs-   They seem to like the whole tank but mostly do have a preference for the bottom - at least half of the time - when walking by that room and going in and looking at the tank.

Last edited by Soft Spot for Fish/Dogs (2010-07-20 13:20:54)

Hi all,

Many thanks for your input, I was so thrilled to open up the board this morning (your night) and see so many have shared their wisdom.

Right, so many questions to answer, will do my best to cover all:

Temp is 26 celcius which is actually 78.8 F, sorry I thought it was 80F.  I have read, however, that Rams like it hot but everyone else in tank prefers this temp so presumed they'd settle with it - I have no intention of breeding.

I have a bubbler the length of the tank and, at the moment I have 2 x Eheim Canisters on it (a 2213 & a 2217) - the latter is seeding for the new big tank.  Despite the 2 x canisters blaring away there's no untoward currents because there's masses of driftwood, rocks & plants.

I was thinking of getting Peat under the EcoComplete (which will be topped with gravel) but a few people have told me it will have nil effect as there'll be little to no water circulation through it, that it's really only effective in a filter.  Problem I have with that is that as the Peat loses it's properties, gets older the PH will go up & down constantly depending on maintenance schedule & longevity of the actual Peat.

They swim just below mid-line, preferring to stay in the undergrowth.  They are not shy at all, they're all swimming end to end & checking everyone & everything out, none are looking poorly or hiding as such.

They are eating well.  No Chloramine, I age my water using a powerhead, heater & bubbler & use Prime with a wee bit of salt.

All Rams here are captive bred locally or out of Asia.  I know many of our fish importers have lost whole buys of Rams to disease and I'm thinking they must be fairly "touchy" as a breed as per Gourami's being historically full of disease & prone to collapse these days?

I guess what's worrying me most of all is their little mouths opening & closing rapidly & their gills flapping faster than any other fish I've seen (not that I've seen many), despite the fact they just merrily swim around & mix with each other.  It's weird, they show absolutely no signs of distress, unhappiness or illness.  But are they really breathing rapidly/frantically or is that what all Rams do?

Last edited by BettaBetta (2010-07-20 17:22:37)

Well, I have some Blue Rams and Gold Rams, and they do the same as yours. I am kinda worried too. I think I will put an air stone in there tanks. I have some baby Electric Blue Rams and they are not breathing that way. Just my older ones.
Thanks """Soft Spot for Fish/Dogs""" for the blues, I love them. Had to get some babies. I have not forgotten you.. I will write tomorrow.

Thank goodness.   Enjoyed your HOT post lotsoffish - I have a newly planted 30gal that I'm waiting for the plants to fill in on, and since the heater is under the substrate, it needs the plants to absorb that heat.  The water is running at 84-86 and I tossed some guppies in there to drop, and then I left the fry in there to grow out, and I was wondering if I was some sort of horrible sinner since everyone kept posting numbers in the 70s as 'right'.  I'm still new to this, but I can watch the fish and I swear they adore the warmth, and the mothers all dropped the second day after I purchased them, so it seemed like they liked it too.

*whew* !  I'll take that post as more correct seeing where it came from.

thanks!

OMG LotsOfFish, thanks ever so much - would you believe I had defrosted some frozen bloodworms, added x 10 drops of Avitrol-Plus (Avian Wormer) that I intended to feed to them tomorrow morning, phew, down the sink they go. 

Right, I'm heading out to turn the temp up right now, that makes it, holy heck, 28.8888889 in my language - hopes everyone else in the tank will be ok with that - I will go up a degree a day.

Hmm what the heck is "whirling disease" - I noticed one of my new Otos behaving in a weird manner yesterday, doing acrobatics like a mad thing & found one dead this morning, as well as a new Blue Ram that I bought on the w/end just gone.  I immediately did a 60% waterchange & everyone seems fine.

Last edited by BettaBetta (2010-07-21 04:48:45)

Jasus Mary & Joseph, yesterday when adjusting the heater temp I forgot to plug it back in so we plummeted down to 23C gaaarrrgh. 

It's now back up to 28C (usually sits on 25/26C) and I have to say that the Rams appear much, much happier, they're scooting around the entire tank now instead of huddling in corners or plants.  Their little mouths are still opening & closing rapidly but I've come to the conclusion that all Rams do that naturally, it's just them.  Their gils aren't flapping & they're as happy as Larry now so thanks a million everyone (for the great PM's) & to you LOF, you saved their little a$$es food & temp wise champ.

BettaBetta wrote:

Hmm what the heck is "whirling disease" - I noticed one of my new Otos behaving in a weird manner yesterday, doing acrobatics like a mad thing & found one dead this morning, as well as a new Blue Ram that I bought on the w/end just gone.  I immediately did a 60% waterchange & everyone seems fine.

I was curious so I looked it up, whirling disease is a caused by a parasite (Myxosoma cerebralis). Here's a video of a infected young trout showing the typical "whirling" movements:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5a0Grry … r_embedded

Sorry about your fishie troubles, I hope it's just a temp/food issue.

Michele

Many thanks Laura, I add the minced garlic from the jar to the dry food & let it soak overnight, it seems to send everyone into a feeding frenzy.  I must say though, I've always been highly skeptical of the powers of garlic when it comes to worming cats, dogs, kids.  I guess with fish the reality is we never see worms expelled, unless of course it's the camallanus ones so one could never say with any degree of accuracy if garlic does in fact work for fish - I give it because they love it and hope that it has some benefit.

Yeppers to rotating all the good foods, although my Rams are the only ones in the tank who don't go for fruit or vegetables, everyone else goes silly for them.

Fortunately my Betta's are all sooks but if I was to get one who didn't get on the with the Rams I'd just keep swapping them all around until I found one who did, or give up & have it just Rams & their buddies only.

Oh, and I loved your landscape barrier idea in the Val thread.   I'll be implementing that for sure in my new tank I'm setting up in a few weeks, will do it all at the time of laying the substrate for sake of ease & convenience so thanks ever so much for that great tip.